1987 Regal with "T" Package

[Derek Hall]

I have a 1987 Regal with "T" Package. I'm curious what it's worth because the Kelly Blue Book figure was insulting last time I checked. It's downfall is the factory Olds 307 and TH200C trans, but otherwise the car is basically a T-Type. It has the following from the factory...

White with Clarett interior, buckets/cosole and leather "T" wheel, blackout trim, front air dams, aluminum bumper reinforcements, T-Type wheels, 3.08 posi, Y56 sport suspension, A/C and cruise, rear defrost, EQ cassette, and Power Astroroof. 87,000 original miles.

Clean and excellent condition throughout. Everything works and the suspension and engine are very tight. Plus the grill, headlight bezels, all front lamps, bumper strips, bumper fillers, air dams, weatherstrips and belt moldings, center caps, lug nuts, shift handle, front/rear speakers, door handles, hood struts, fluid tanks, and all emblems have been replaced with brand new GM original parts. It even has a Delco battery and all the tune up parts are Delco right down to the oil filter.

The car is completely stock except for three things. It has 235/60R15 tires, I added a GN trunk spoiler and upgraded to the Olds 442 dual exhaust setup (being that they share the 307Y code engine)

With exception of the lack of premium horsepower, the car looks great and drives very nice. It will run with a Monte SS without trouble also.

Thanks for your opinions

[Keller]

I have a 1987 Regal with "T" Package <snip> but otherwise the car is basically a T-Type.

Sounds like you have a very nice, well maintained and cared for car. Unforunately, its really not a "T-Type".

In '87, the non-GN Regals went very "ala carte". The T package was mostly an appearance/suspension package. It did not even include the blackout trim. In some ways, this was great! Things like T Regal Limiteds with leather split bench seats and LC2 engines. Or sneaky T Regals with LC2 engines and no blackout trim. On the other hand, the T package was available was with any motor. Even a normally aspirated V6. Imagine a T with blackout and a wheezy little NA V6. All dressed up and no ability to go...

In short, I'm sure the '84-'86 T-Type owners take issue with your car being a "T-Type". Theirs are T-Types, through and through.

As far as value...There are so many parts that go into making a Turbo Regal a 'turbo car' vs. a V6/V8 car, that there is a REAL reason they have retained/gained value. Different motor (and all related components - different crank, different rods, different pistons, different cam, different intake, etc.), all attached compnents (turbo, intercooler, fuel injection components, etc.), transmission, rear end, fuel tank, fuel lines, inner fenders, dashboard, wiring, subtle frame differences (to handle the trans crossmember), radiator, cooling fan, hood...the list goes on.

Over the years, we are consistently asked by young Regal owners: "I have a V6 Regal. Can I just put a turbo on it?" The answer is clearly "no".

So...What is your V8 T worth. Its in good shape. Has low miles for being 18 years old. Has been well maintained. I'd say worth more than the average Regal, but not a lot. Keep in mind, its still an 18 year old Regal. Albeit a pretty one.

If you are concerned about getting a number for insurance purposes or other means, I would highly recommend having an appraisal done by someone properly certified to do so. This is a good idea for all of these cars, turbo or not. Especially since they are so easily stolen.

In short, I would not anticipate near-TR values for your V8 T. Just my opinion.

With exception of the lack of premium horsepower, the car looks great and drives very nice. It will run with a Monte SS without trouble also.

Yeah...we're not impressed with the SS's either. ;)

[Derek Hall]

Mr. Keller...

In the few days I've been a member of your site I've read enough of your posts to know that you are a purist and very knowledgable in Turbo Regals, which are good qualities and I admire that. I have also noticed that you are sometimes a bit harsh in some of your replies to other member's posts.

For starters, I never said the car was a T-Type. After clearly noting that the car is a non-turbo model with a V8, I made the comment that the car is "basically a T-Type" for two reasons. One being that many people do not know that a regular Regal was available with the "T" package and many of the other options I listed that are also on turbo cars. How often does the average car guy see one...rare if ever. The second being that the car is basically a T-Type option-wise, short of the performance drivetrain and a few other things like the hood, powermaster brakes, etc. I think that true T-Type owners understood what I meant and can see the point I was making. I highly doubt that what I said offended anyone on these boards or anywhere else.

In addition, I'm not some young kid with a V6 Regal asking about bolt-on turbos. I may not know a turbo Regal inside and out, but I know a lot about the cars and I am well aware of the differences between a standard Regal and a T-Type or Grand National. Also, I have owned and built many muscle cars new and old from 250 to 800 horsepower and I know what it takes to build a performance car. If you have any doubts, I'll show you my 496 big block Chevelle that runs 9's all day. So you can save that comment for the high school kids with sport compacts.

I compared my car to a Monte Carlo SS only to give you a basic idea of how it performs.

I was offended by the KBB figure because it was way less than $500, not for any other reason. I don't expect turbo Regal money for a 185hp V8 Regal, but I did expect someone as knowledgable as you to have a general idea of the vehicle's value. Instead you offend me with your comments, making unsubstanciated judgements and twisting my words. If this is the kind of treatment I can expect from you using this forum, then you don't have to worry about seeing me here again.

Finally....did you hear me say "it's just another 18 year old Grand National", or T-Type, or GNX, about whatever car you own? No....because everyone likes their car for any one of a hundred different reasons, and that's all that matters. You of all people should know that!

It sounds like you have a case of "If it's not a Turbo Regal it's nothing"

And if my car isn't "basically" a T-Type at least in some ways, why is it that it is 98% factory stock and looks just like the car in your AVATAR? Funny...huh?

Now you've heard MY opinion...

[Keller]

Mr. Hall

I'm sorry if you took offense at my comments. Certainly not my intent. And if I seem to come off a bit harsh...well, I don't always mesh well with everyone.

I stand by my comment that your car isn't what the "T-Type" owners would call a "T-Type". Please understand that this isn't necessarily my take on the matter. If we had the full brunt of the membership from the mailing list we had before we moved the site (thousands), I could imagine the real purists ready to strike back at such a comment. Yes, your car shares the wheels, suspension, look, and whatnot with the turbo cars. But there is a certain something missing that appeals to those with greasy fingernails and a desire to plug laptops into their cars. I think a large number of the owners find the drivetrain is what holds much of the appeal.

As far as the rarity of V8/V6 T package cars, a lot has to do with where you are in North America. While travelling for business, I've found that they were far more prevalent in the northeastern US than elsewhere. (Even saw one parked on the street in Manhattan!) But they are quite rare. As far as the KBB figure you cited - I would hope you could get the car appraised for 7-10x that. Or more.

I certainly don't suffer a case of "If it's not a Turbo Regal it's nothing". Note that I have owned a few NA (non-T) V6 Regals myself. However, Turbo Regals are what this site is about. That's what it says right on the front page. And so it has been for 13 years.

[Derek Hall]

For the record....I absolutely DO NOT consider my car in the same category or level as a Turbo Regal in any way other than appearance. If you read my recent posts under the TTA section, you'll clearly see that I am soon to aquire an 85 WH-1 T-Type and I'm looking for an 87 Turbo Regal soon, for no other reason than there is no substitue for, in my opinion, the best engine GM ever built...considering a V6 that walks all over V8 cars all day and has nearly unlimited potential for growth.

With that being said, I appreciate your response and perhaps I was a bit harsh with you as well. I believe now we are on the same page, you understanding me and I'm understanding you.

Although I do not travel for business as you do and I don't know as much about these cars as you, I do know enough about them to know that my car is rare and unfortunately that's about it....at least at this period of time. Even though it may be worth half (or even less) the value of a Turbo Regal, it is still something special to me....and I'm sure you can appreciate that. ;)

You had commented on Non-turbo "T" Package cars being prevalent in the northeast....well, that doesn't surprise me because my car was sold new in Pennsylvania and the only other two I've seen were in New York and Connecticut.

Thanks for your time and thoughts. I ssume this discussion has been resolved and we can move on :D

[vipers t type]

Ok I can say by reading your replyes that we all love and apreciate the Reagal in general.I have owned from 78 to 84 whitch im currently building.The T Type is the generic of the Grand National , with this ive seen the mini me of the GN walk all over its big brother.What im trying to say you eather have one or you dont, and dont mean to be disrespectful.My 84 HOT AIR T TYPE is my baby if you will, Ive been beat and I have swallowed V8 cars.Their is nothing like having people look and stare at my black T TYPE when im at a stop light , its like a natural high.SO WHAT IM TRYING TO SAY IS THAT THEIR IS NOTHING LIKE A T TYPE OR GRAND NATIONAL.

[Derek Hall]

:confused: :crackup: :bored:

[captn23]

i bought an 87 't'. excellent condition except for a broken windshield in brooklyn ny.the odometer read 65k and it seemed like it might not of turned over, but hard to tell. it came with the olds v8 and gn posi rear, but was transplanted with a small block 350, th350, a true dual exhaust and gn interior. i payed $1000 for it. i hope this helps you out. i bought it to fix the body of my sleeper regal(87 gn transplant) that was involved in an 11 car pile-up. so i really did not 'want' it. i stripped it and sold the drivetrain and interior for more than what i bought the entire car for. the rest is in a junk yard now. i did not find kellers response offensive at all. he doesnt know you, just what you wrote. i do not mean to gang up on you, but maybe we shouldnt be so sensitive.
ive seen people trying to sell 86-7 turbo regals for thousands with junk or no motor at all, just because it originally came with the turbo/intercooled engine. of course, selling price and asking price are always a different story. its all about how bad an enthusiest wants it, or how bad an owner needs to unload it(but we all know this). turbo/intercooled regals have a huge following. it is just the way it is. check out the difference in value between the 84-5 and the 86-7 grand national.
p.s.-buick does sell more cars in the northeast than anywhere else- why? i do not know but gn's are still pretty common here. i am sure the owner of my t could of got more for it, if it was not so common here. the car was super straight and did look real nice.